Building Better Carrier Relationships Through Marketing, Trust, and Visibility with Clara Flaherty

In this episode of TMSA’s On the Move, Jennifer Karpus-Romain talks with Clara Flaherty about her career journey, the evolving role of marketing in transportation, and the work being done at CarrierSource to strengthen relationships between carriers and the companies they work with. Clara shares insights into brand trust, reputation, and visibility in the logistics space, along with how authentic community involvement can create unexpected professional growth opportunities. The conversation also explores Clara’s journey from past ELEVATE breakout speaker to this year’s mainstage lineup and what she’s most excited to bring to the stage in Denver

Check out the Transportation Sales and Marketing Association (TMSA) website or engage with us on LinkedIn.

Transcript

Welcome And Guest Introduction

SPEAKER_00 0:22

Hello, everyone, and welcome to On the Move, a show where we share transportation sales and marketing success stories. I am Jennifer Korpus Romain, Executive Director of TMSA, a trade nonprofit, educating and connecting marketing and sales professionals in transportation and logistics. Today on the show, I'm excited to have Clara Flarity, head of growth and co-founder at Carrier Source. Welcome to the show, Clara. How are you doing?

SPEAKER_02 0:46

Thank you. I'm good. Thanks so much for having me. I've been a longtime fan, first time participant. So I'm excited to be.

SPEAKER_00 0:52

I love it. And as I told that we were talking a little bit before we we jumped on, like I love doing this show because it allows me to know people for years, but then I get to like do a deep dive into their LinkedIn and their life and then hopefully pull out some nuggets that people don't know about you. So excited to dive into some of that stuff. But in case people aren't familiar with carrier source and what you guys do, can let's start

What CarrierSource Actually Does

SPEAKER_00 1:16

there. Talk about what your company does and the problem that you're really trying to solve in the industry.

SPEAKER_02 1:20

Totally. Um, so carrier source is at its core a review platform. We have a profile for every active carrier, every active broker. Um, the easiest way to think of it is like a Yelp for the trucking industry. Uh so on each of these profiles, we pull in FMCSA safety and insurance information. And then also we have uh people able to write reviews of their experiences with these companies. So um we kind of stood up the site originally because we looked around the industry and we saw there was really no way for carriers to receive positive feedback online. There was, you know, the carrier 411s of the world, the TIA watchdog, important um things and important uh, you know, review platforms, but there wasn't really anywhere where you could identify, okay, not only is this the worst carrier to carry my braid, but here are the best carriers. Um so we tried to put that uh positive spin on it. Um and so we've we've built this platform. It's been up for about um start turned up first version of the site in November of 2020. Um, so now here we are, May 2026. Um, and we've a big part of what we do too is we've been able to amass a lot of organic traffic just because of um the reviews that we're gathering. SEO loves user-generated content. Um, so we've kind of become a hub for the shippers of the world, the brokers of the world, and the carriers of the world to come and find their next great partner. Um so it's been a really, really fun journey uh and exciting to build.

SPEAKER_00 2:52

Yeah, I love that. And because like, yeah, it's like it's so we gravitate towards the negative and those, those, of course, you want to be able to have that identification of when things go wrong or bad, but like, yeah, we have positive experiences. I do think typically as humans, we only report on the the best and the worst and like nothing is seen. But it's good that there's a space that you can do all of the above and then um really be able to to find that footing, especially if people are newer to the industry or don't know like what make what makes a good uh career and like how how can we participate in this and what does that look like? And so that's great that you guys have been able to develop that and um have it for the past couple years.

SPEAKER_02 3:33

Yeah, and on that, like we really didn't see anywhere where people could review brokers, which is such an important part of it. Like it's always ever been one-sided, it feels like before we really came into it. Um, so that's been a fun uh thing to navigate as well, is now having broker profiles and brokers being like, wait, it's like no, no, no, it's all fit, everybody's good. And we gotten a lot of positive reviews on brokerages from their carrier partners and shipper customers too. So it's been fun to watch.

SPEAKER_00 4:00

That's great, especially because I do think so often like brokerages have that negative connotation on it. And so creating a space where people can see the positive side of it and the positive reviews I think is really a powerful place for our industry.

SPEAKER_02 4:14

Totally.

Why Reviews Shape Transportation Growth

SPEAKER_00 4:15

So, as the head of growth at carrier source, how do you think that reputation and transparency really does impact a company's ability to grow in today's transportation market?

SPEAKER_02 4:25

Yeah, I think I mean, I think it's so huge. I think we even look at our own lives, and I use reviews literally every single day. When I'm finding a restaurant, when I'm buying something on Amazon, when I'm, you know, looking for the best movie to go after. Like we use that Rotten Tomatoes, those Amazon reviews, the Google reviews, open table. Yeah, whatever it is, we're always, always reading reviews. Um, and I think it was kind of surprising to us that this already, this hadn't already been created in the transportation space because it is such a space ripe for that kind of customer feedback to help companies grow or you know, or fail. Um, so it was it was interesting coming into the space and realizing that that that wasn't even really here. Um, our background comes from reviews. I like to say my background in my career has been reviews. I worked at a company called G2.com, which is the Yelp for software for a long time. And the reason we even carrier sources, Rob, our CEO, was talking to one of his best friends who was a carrier sales rep who was asking him about G2, because Rob worked at G2 with me. And Rob was like telling him that we gather reviews on behalf of software companies. And his carrier sales rep friend was like, Man, if I had that in my job, my life would be a whole lot easier. And so that's kind of how it how it even came to be was that that request by this carrier sales rep for I need some transparent, real information that's not just the company's marketing team or the negative reviews that I'm reading on career 411. I need I want to find the best people and I want to be able to work with them too. So I think it is it is so important for every industry, but specifically transportation, where your word matters so much, the relationships matter so much, um, and having that that ability to see that through the reviews.

SPEAKER_00 6:16

A hundred percent. Actually, when you were talking about G2, so I used to work in software, so I got like a blast from the past of my brain. I used to love the the quadrant reports of like the software comparison. Those are my jam because, like, yes, I would work, I would worked at like a software integrator. So it'd be like obviously the ones that you integrated into you would want to be in certain quadrant parts. Yeah, and so I stared at those charts a lot in my past life. So that really like my brain went right, like I could see them in my mind's eye when you were talking. Um, but yeah, it is so important those reviews, especially the user-generated ones, because you know, you want people that are actually using the systems or working with the the um carriers, working with the brokers, that's where you're trusting, like you said, everywhere. I can't, I was actually thinking like yesterday I had to impromptu get a hotel. I looked at the reviews before I booked it because I'm like, go to a random town. I'm not trying to just, you know, I want at least 4.2 or higher if I'm going to a random place, you know, and those it's so important in all facets. Totally.

SPEAKER_02 7:23

But even you saying that, like, okay, yeah, like you're we get we get a lot of companies who talk to us, like, okay, well, I just got this negative review, I just got this one star review. Like, what am I supposed to do about that? And we're like, honestly, having one or two negative reviews is kind of a great thing. Um, because if you have all five stars, people are not gonna trust that every every other review you have. Nobody's perfect, especially in transportation. Like something goes wrong, whether it's no matter whose fault it is, something is gonna go wrong at least some percent of the time. Um, so yeah, like people look for that. Like 4.5 to 4.9 is what people are looking for to work with. That's like, okay, great, that's someone who clearly has real reviews because they have some negative ones, but overall it's doing a great job. Um, yeah, it's funny that you said that.

SPEAKER_00 8:13

Totally agree. And as someone who does live and breathe by reviews and other facets of life, reading the negative reviews, you're like, oh no, that person's crazy. Like, yeah, and you know, and you can see that be like, okay, or like, yeah, and like Amazon, you're like, okay, like when people give reviews and it's not like they're um giving it a one-star review because it didn't do like a function that they're not even supposed to do. We were like, well, clearly you bought the wrong thing. So, like, I don't know why you're giving a negative review, just buy the product you're looking for. And so I do think, um, to your point, like, yes, like if it's all five star all the time, then you're like, I don't believe you. I think you pay people to have a paid promotion and then you put your reviews in there. So um, I think that's really important, which I think you know, to this point, like allowing those negative reviews to exist and also like looking at them, and obviously if you need to make adjustments or whatever, but what are some of the biggest mistakes that you see companies making when it comes to how they position themselves to carriers or like getting the reviews and then how do they handle some of that feedback that they're seeing?

SPEAKER_02 9:22

Yeah, so just to pull on the negative reviews trend a little bit more, I think I think it is such a mistake when when people ignore, either ignore the negative reviews or try to silence them. I think they're such a such an important piece of the puzzle that consumers look for and seek out. Like we want to read the negative stuff so that we know, like, oh yeah, that's not a big deal. I can handle that, or no, that's a deal breaker for me, and I'm not gonna, I'm not gonna engage with this. Um, but also not not responding to reviews, especially the negative ones and it's responding in a way that's like, thank you so much for your, you know, for your feedback. Here's what we've done to address the concerns that you've that you've said. We hope you come back and give us our business. It's so many customers who would leave a negative review just don't say anything, and you have no chance to win that customer back. So at least with a negative review, a customer has raised their hand and been like, I'm unhappy, and you have that opportunity to win back that repeat business. Um, so I would say that that's one of the

Handling Negative Reviews With Credibility

SPEAKER_02 10:20

big ones. The other one that I see a lot is which I I think TMSA has done a great job of talking about this throughout the years too, is not identifying what you're best at and trying to be everything for everyone. That's something we hear so much from the shippers using our site. Um, like I get these calls from people telling me, like, I can do anything for you. And it's like, well, no, you can't. I know you can't. So tell me what you're best at, and then maybe we can start there, and then you can grow into my business if you need to. But so many companies, I feel like just try and do this like, we can do anything for the right price. And you gotta narrow in, you gotta figure out who do you serve the best, who are you best fit to support and and service, and then and then go from there.

SPEAKER_00 11:06

Absolutely. That is one of the soapboxes I like to stand on a lot. So I'm sure if you're a longtime listener of this podcast, that is something we talk about a lot because they don't care if you can do everything anyway, they just care about what you can do for them. So I don't even know why that's the pitch, because it's like one, I don't believe you. And then by saying that, yeah, you're not identifying the areas that you are best at. And so, and those are gonna be your best customers, like working towards your ICP and actually like I know everyone wants to make the money, and money is good. You want revenue important, but if you're then overstepping your boundary and taking something that isn't in your wheelhouse, that's probably where you're getting those negative reviews because you didn't handle it the best you could. Yeah, you weren't able to actually accommodate or move as fast or have the transparency that you would in your wheelhouse, and so then you're getting those negative reviews for something that you probably shouldn't have taken in the first place.

SPEAKER_02 12:00

Totally. Yeah. Um and I think too, like not another like another mistake on that is not even not using the reviews, not engaging with your reviews. And you should use your reviews as marketing collateral because they tell customers or they tell prospects that customers already trust and um want to work with you. And so if you're using those specific reviews, like let's say you get a review from a shipper in consumer goods, and you know that you have a prospect that is in consumer goods, you use that review, make a one-pager highlighting that great review you have from shipper A that matches shipper B. All of a sudden, shipper B is way more inclined to trust you because they've seen that direct feedback.

SPEAKER_00 12:39

100%. I agree. And even with that, like how you're talking about responding to negative reviews, like, number one, don't respond to them if you're crabby. Like be appropriate. Um, and like make it because I always view it like, yeah, you may never win that that person back that's actually complaining. But every other person that's reading this review, seeing how you're handling it, seeing the transparency of your like, yep, we did make that mistake, but here's all the things that we fixed since then, they're gonna then respect you for having that transparency, for having that open communication, for being honest about what happened. So even if you think of it like you're not responding for that person, you're responding for everybody else who's reading it, then that can be a good perception and maybe not be as snarky when you respond. Sometimes you want to be snarky.

SPEAKER_02 13:29

And sometimes I'll read because like I read the responses that people leave on reviews, and I'll be like, ooh, it's like a reality show on carrier source sometimes.

SPEAKER_00 13:41

But again, so and like yes, if I'm then looking for who my next partner's gonna be, and I see that somebody made a legitimate complaint and you're being smart, snarky to them, you're not it, like you're not gonna be it. And so yeah, it's the same as like, you know, when you want to respond to an email and you're like, nope, I should wait a minute. It's the same concept, yeah. Everyone gets Krebby, but that doesn't mean that that should go on record.

SPEAKER_02 14:06

Yeah, yeah, yeah. On written record that then is on the interwebs for the rest of forever. Like, yeah, pause and take a breath for sure.

Building A Public Voice On LinkedIn

SPEAKER_00 14:16

Um, so I want to talk about kind of like you like and your development into this. So you have built a strong voice and presence in the industry, and like you are a trusted voice, and people do go to carrier source, and you're a big part of carrier source, obviously. So, what was something that was intentional for you professional? Was that something intentional? You're like, oh, we're gonna create the space of voices, and then with that, me and Rob become voices in the industry, or did that just happen organically because of the platform you guys built?

SPEAKER_02 14:48

We did make a conscious choice at one point, Rob and I both, who both have never really posted up, like we both like to be a little bit behind the scenes. Um, but we both made a conscious choice in a pact of like we need to be more actively calling out what we're doing. We need to be speaking about it because no one else is. There, our team that there's seven of us. We hired um Kevin Hill about a year ago now. He's almost at his anniversary as our head of sales, and he's a really active voice in the industry. Um, he's you know, he's built a built a great following through his his career. Um, and so we kind of looked to him as our inspiration of like Kevin's doing it, like we can do it too. So we did start posting more and start really throwing our hands up for podcast opportunities or event speaking, and just like, and it was it was helpful to have it's kind of like the you know the buddy system of like making a patch of like, okay, we're both gonna do this, or we're both gonna, if we say something silly, like that's okay, because we both are posting and someone else is gonna say something silly. Um, so it was really a conscious effort to try and be that that voice of authority in some in some ways, or that you know, being able to really broadcast um the messaging, especially around intent data, which Kara Smith Brown has done an incredible job of, you know, she's really brought that to the industry, I feel like. So being able to be a supporting voice on that um has has been has been a big learning opportunity for me. Um, and it's been fun to to be doing it as well.

SPEAKER_00 16:20

I actually was last uh one of the broker carrier summits last year. I was on a panel with Rob and Kara.

SPEAKER_03 16:27

So it was funny. We talked about it.

SPEAKER_00 16:29

So it was funny that you mentioned that. Yeah, I think it's definitely a transition. And like I was curious what your answer to that was gonna be because for me, I came from I started my career in journalist, you don't share your thoughts or opinions because that's like against the rules. And then I switched to marketing, and then it was all okay, we put our president out and he's gonna sound smart. Like, my whole job is to stand in the corner and let him do his thing, and so then taking this role at TMSA and all of a sudden being the person that goes on the podcast and being the person that's like going to the trade shows and talking to people, like what people are talking, people are talking to me now, and I am sound smart all the time, it's awful. And I don't like to your point, it's like nope, and sometimes you're gonna sound stupid. I every once in a while watch back these interviews, but most of the time I just can't like or I just watch the clips of the other humans because I I can't, then I'll get in my head too much of like what I look like or what I'm saying, yeah. But it is it is a transition to do that, but I like what you said. Like, if we're not saying it and not talking about what we're doing, no one else is gonna be doing it. So we kind of have to do that, and that that was always like when I did work at like marketing agencies and stuff, that was the big I've always loved to work in like the industrial spaces and stuff, and that was all so people are gonna talk about you, so like, do you want to be leading that conversation or do you want someone else too? And that was really that like like um perception change for a lot of people because they're just like, no, no one's gonna talk about it. No, they will, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 18:09

And I feel like like it's also a little like a hurdle to you have to get over the uncomfortable part of like you you have to share your opinions and you have to have a stance and you have to have a take, and it's okay if I'm like such a people pleaser, and so a big hurdle for me is it's okay if people disagree with you or if someone thinks that your idea is not right, like that's part of the beauty of collaboration and growth, and you know, so it's like but getting over that hurdle, like what if someone comments and says I'm wrong? You know, like it's okay. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 18:41

I had um, I had my first troll at one point at the end of last year, and that was an experience. And I and I was like, Oh, but I feel like that means I'm saying something of note or worthy. I just talked about how one of the reasons why I love TMSA is because it's allowed me to like be a female and a leader and still have tattoos and purple hair, and no one's ever said anything. Like and like and like and I I remember when I first got into like the job market, like I would cover all my tattoos up and then I would be mad at myself because I always said, if if I didn't, if it's an environment that doesn't want me to be me, I don't want to work there, and so I worked in a lot of places that were a little rough for me because and then I was like, but if I would have just stuck to that, then I probably would have ended in different places, and some guy was like, I will never hire you. I'm like, but then I don't want to work for you. Like, that's the point. Yeah, great, yeah. Um but I was so funny, bro. I was like, Oh, my first troll. This is fun.

SPEAKER_02 19:48

That's a big milestone. That's like you get a new level when you have a troll.

SPEAKER_00 19:52

I was like, and like people I didn't know were commenting on my post. I was like, oh, okay. Um, but but it was it was funny, but it does, it takes a minute to be like, okay, also I'm in the public forum, and so I am saying things, and people are probably not going to agree with me or not care about what I'm saying or whatever. But I I agree with like the I want people, especially like um on committees at TMSA or in those decision making, I want people to disagree with me. I want them to challenge my train of thought because if everyone just agreed with me, we're not putting out the best product or the best. So, like I I've never worked for a transportation company. So as the leader of TMSA, I want our education um committee to be leading the who's picking the people on our stages, not me. I mean, I've learned so much in the role and I've sold to the industry and I've been a part of it. So it's not to discredit my own brain or anything like that, but you want the people in the roles to have that voice and to be there. And if everyone is just like, oh no, we're just gonna do whatever Jen says, well, Jen's not gonna be able to put together the best programming by herself. And so I think like that's really important, and that's what I've always been like. I will never be the person that's like, oh, we've always done it this way, so this is how we're doing it. Yeah, um, and if I ever say that, just fire me because then you're not in that space um to collaborate. So it is definitely a transition though, and I was I was curious how you felt about that

Falling Into Logistics And Loving It

SPEAKER_00 21:25

as well.

SPEAKER_02 21:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 21:26

Um, so you did talk a little bit at the beginning of how you guys kind of got in the transportation and logistics industry because you're like, okay, what if we take this thing that we were doing over here, but then move it over here? What how do you feel about the industry? Like they always say, like, once you're here, you'll never leave. Do you feel that way now that you're here?

SPEAKER_01 21:46

I do.

SPEAKER_02 21:47

It's it's funny because Rob Rob started the company on his own first, and then he brought on me and the other co founders, Mark Myers and Hamet Asgari. Um, but he c the Way I first got into it, I was still working at G2, and Rob I knew had left to start, you know, he was like some trucking thing, and it was like, All right, good luck, Rob. Like, I didn't know anything about you know, I didn't know anything about transportation or logistics or trucking. Um, and I got a call from Rob one day. I was like, Hey, how do you have this number B? Like how it's going.

unknown 22:19

Just kidding.

SPEAKER_02 22:20

But he did call me and he said, I had been on the reviews team at G2. So my whole job was just getting people to write reviews of software. Um, and he called me and said, you know, I started this thing, carrier source, and I'm trying to get people to write reviews. Do you have any ideas of how I could do that? And I was like, sure, let me let me think through it a little bit, think about the industry a little, and I'll give you a call back with some of my ideas. He's like, Great. I called him back like three days later, I told him my ideas. He was like, Cool, want a job? And then I sat and thought about it and I was like, yeah, why not? Yeah. Um, it was kind of a point in my life and career where taking a risk like this on a startup was it was kind of worked out perfectly. I was in a spot where I could do it. Um, I'd love G2 and I would have worked at G2, I feel like, for the rest of my life. Um, so I was kind of, I had been at thinking of a point of like, is this where my whole career is gonna be? Like, cool, but is that is that definitely what I want? So when Rob reached out, it was like, all right, yeah, this is a sign that I should I should go after this. And I'll regret saying no. Um, so now I've been in transportation for I'm coming up on my fourth year next month since I joined Carrier Source and since being in this industry. Um and I love it. It's there's so much to learn, it's so different, like that's than tech, uh as I'm sure you have also experienced. Like there's so many facets of it that I just had no idea. And like learning even about transportation, you just don't think about it. Unless you're in it, you don't think about it. Things just show up and they show up when they show up, and the logistics of it, it's like, yeah, somebody figured that out. But like truck driving, I don't know, like it's just all it's all so interesting to learn about. And I'm grateful to have gotten to be um brought into a new industry, still with the tech background. I'm grateful for my tech um understanding because I think it opened my mind in ways that I that I wouldn't be able to now understand transportation in the same way if I hadn't had that background. Um, but it does picturing not being in transportation as kind of like, is that possible for me now?

unknown 24:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 24:33

Well, and I think I do, like they say, like once you're here, and I I think it's about the people in the relationships too. Um like there's so many great people, and you love seeing them at shows and connecting with them and like watching their careers grow. Like I love watching Link watching LinkedIn. I love watching LinkedIn and like seeing when people like get their job promotions, and it's like, yeah, they're staying in longer. Like, yeah, and I I do, I think that's a big part of it. And I think too, those career relationships are built on trust. And I think some of the companies are still underestimating really how much their reputation would then be impacting their recruiting, their retention, their partnership building, all of those things kind of are all encompassing. Is that some of the patterns that you're seeing right now? Or is something else kind of driving that?

SPEAKER_01 25:23

No, we definitely are seeing that.

SPEAKER_02 25:24

And what's interesting is because so many companies, there's there's so many smaller fleets and small, like owner ops make up so much of the business. And a lot of them don't have websites, a lot of them don't really have an online presence. So we are finding a lot of our site traffic is people Googling the name of a one-truck, two-truck carrier to come read their reviews. And reviews is really the best way that you can market yourself. It's a free way to tell the world how great you are. And that's that's kind of when we first set up carrier source, we were trying to build a solution for the small carrier of like, hey, come claim this profile. You don't even need a website. You can put onto this profile the services you run, the you know, the lanes you operate on, anything specialized you do, logo, description, whatever it is, and then gather those reviews from your customers to tell people who you are and to showcase your brand. Um, so I think it, I think it just is so important, not only for the transparency and the trust, but also just for being being findable, being findable online. And now not only with uh SEO, but also with AEO, the answer engine optimization side of it, like you have to be thinking about both. And if you're not, you need to then at least be gauging with platforms that are thinking about both, because you that's like I think that it will take a lot longer for everyone to migrate over to a answer engines as their first way to search, but the shift is happening and it's it's been very interesting to watch as we've tried to double down on how do we get um, how do we make sure we're always appearing in those searches.

SPEAKER_00 27:03

I think that makes sense, and I think it's it's important to think through those pieces, and um yeah, like you said, there's so many of those small um people in the game, and how can they keep up in a way that you know they probably don't want to spend the time building a full website, and if they can have a space to point people to to be like, hey, and then you get those reviews, it's really powerful instead of then spending time doing things in other places. So I think that is really important. I think the relationship aspect, and then you can see the reviews of the relationships that we're having, it all comes together, yeah. Full circle.

Elevate Preview And Intent Data Level-Up

SPEAKER_02 27:45

Yep.

SPEAKER_00 27:45

So one in a different type of full circle, we're gonna um talk about Elevate for a little bit. Um, so Elevate is our show at TMSA, it's coming up in a few weeks, June 7th through 9th in Denver. You can still join us. Let me pull up this Q register for Elevate at events.tmsa today.org. But uh why I was thinking the full circle, so I like I said, I love on LinkedIn, watching LinkedIn and watching people kind of like grow in their career. And so this year I was so excited because you were picked by the education committee, as we talked about um before, to have a main stage session. And so you've spoken at TMSA as a breakout speaker, and now you're kind of taking the main stage this year. So, what has this growth journey been like for you? And what are you looking forward to coming to Elevate?

SPEAKER_02 28:35

It's been it's been funny because yeah, I've this is this is gonna be my third year attending uh Elevate and year one, I was just an attendee. Year two, I did a breakout session, and yeah, year three now I'm on the main stage, which I'm so excited about. Um, I'm grateful for TMSA for for the opportunity for it. Obviously, it's it's been an incredible place to be able to grow my career, which is a shout out TMSA of just a good spot. I entered the industry again, knowing nothing four years ago. Um, and TMSA has been instrumental in getting helping me not only educate myself on how I should even be trying to market in this industry, um, but also the the relationships that I've made made and the and the people that I've met um have allowed me to not only the to be able to grow, but also the confidence to be able to grow. Like I do feel that because I know so many people who will be in the room at Elevate, it is kind of like a okay, like, and I'm gonna get to tell a lot of pals about Nintendo, you know what I mean? Like it's it's less so like room of strangers and more room of people who want me to succeed and are interested in what I have to say. Um, which I really felt it even at the breakout session too. Like people, you know, were very generous in their feedback afterwards, and it was like they didn't have to be, you know. Um, so it's been it's been I'm I'm I'm so excited. It's been very fun to be able to grow in that way with TMS I.

SPEAKER_00 30:05

I love it and love getting to see that that projection without giving away your whole session. What are you talking about at Elevate?

SPEAKER_02 30:15

So last year in my breakout session, I talked about intent data. Um, and really that was meant to be kind of a foundational talk. I feel like intent data had really just entered the industry with with Kara Smith Brown and her The Revenue Engine. Great book. Um, so I think people were really starting to talk about it and you were hearing it more and more everywhere you went. And so my talk at that point was just kind of foundational. Here's what this is, and how you could find a way to start using it. Um now this next year, I'm trying to level up that talk. So it's still speaks a little bit to the foundation of what it is, but then goes much deeper on like, okay, now way more people have it. Now the table stakes are intent data. What's not what is the level up is people executing on it and executing on it well. Um, whereas last year it felt very much like a here's what it even is, and you should have it to be to be moving forward faster, but now it's you need to be using it correctly, and here's how. So that's what I'll be speaking to, and I'm I'm very excited.

SPEAKER_00 31:17

I love it. I think it's a really great topic, and I agree. Like it's not just about knowing what it is, but how to apply it, how to use it, and how to move forward with it so that you don't get left behind. And so I think that's really great. Um, and you talked about just like your career and growing with TMSA. One of the things you do here is being involved in the membership committee as well. And so that's something that then you're able to do kind of year-round outside of elevate. Why was it important to you to stay involved even beyond just attending events or speaking at events?

SPEAKER_02 31:49

I think when I joined the membership committee, I felt like I just wanted to know more people. And I figured, what better way to do that than to be on the committee whose literal job is to make sure people feel welcome and known. Um, so it's been a wonderful experience being on it. And I've gotten to that's where I've met most of the people that I've met. Um, and you know, Don was my first like intro call to TMSA, and I knew he was on the membership committee. So then I was like, all right, Don's on the membership committee, maybe I'll join the membership committee. Um, and so it's it's been it's been so fun to be a part of.

SPEAKER_00 32:27

I love that. Um, and I do, I think getting involved in committees really allow you to take that um opportunity to, like you said, oh, when I'm when I'm speaking, it's like a room of friends, basically, like people I know. It makes it a lot easier. That's how like I my first speaking engagement ever, I think, was at TMSA. Like I had done webinars at one of my old jobs, but like first time I ever really took a stage was at um at a TMSA event back in like 2018, I think. So yeah, so it's it is really cool to see that.

Theater Skills That Translate To Business

SPEAKER_00 33:03

Um, so one of my favorite things about this podcast was getting to like we've known each other for a couple of years, you've been on the membership committee, you've spoken at a conference, we've seen each other at other conferences, but I got to like sit in your LinkedIn, and I realized that outside of your logistics work and your time here, you won a statewide theater award for your performance as Lucy Brown in the Three Penny Opera. And you also then have a volunteer not just with us, but you volunteer with the Saints volunteers for the performing arts. And I was really thinking about like how well you then show up on stage because you're able to communicate, present, show up professionally. So I'm curious your perspective on how that like theater background and kudos on winning a statewide theater award, but how does that shape you in this industry being able to stand on stage and really present information in a in a more meaningful way?

SPEAKER_02 33:59

Yeah. Um, it's so funny. I think like theater is such a a big part of my life and who I am. I I majored in theater my whole, you know, like it was all my whole my whole trajectory in childhood going through college was like I'm gonna be an actor full time. Um, and that is still a dream of mine that I am, you know, that I may who knows, you life is long, you know what I mean? Um maybe retirement, but um the skills that I got when I when I have you know been learning theater and going through this, like the the major and and all of that, you you learn how to work with all kinds of people. Everybody makes jokes about artists, like you learn how to work with all kinds of people. Um, you learn that communication, you are comfortable uh in front of people. You know, there's so many skills that that come to you that you don't think about really neat. It's like, oh, what am I gonna do with a theater degree? But then you go into the workforce and it's like I can empathize with people. You know, I've and because I've spent years building these skills. Um, so I'm I'm very grateful for what it's what it's given me and what it's taught me, the vulnerability piece and like not being afraid to be you, because you have to be you, because that's your whole brand when you're a when you're a theater person, you know what I mean? Um, so it's definitely shaped not only a lot of who I am now, but my professional career as well.

SPEAKER_00 35:22

I love that.

Advice On Worry And Closing

SPEAKER_00 35:24

Well, that takes us to our last question of the show, the one I asked everyone who comes on, if you could go back in time and advise your younger self anything personally or professionally, when would you go back to and what would you say?

SPEAKER_02 35:37

This was a hard one. I was thinking of this for a while. I was like, oh um, I do think that I wish that I'd I I just wish that I'd worried less, which hindsight is 2020, but like I feel like every decision has been so painstaking of like, well, is this the right one? Like, is this gonna get me where I need to be? Like, you know, deciding to major in theater was a was a big one of like, what is that really gonna do? But it's I think for I just wish I'd I'd spent less time worrying because I I do think like your path, the choices you make, the person you are, you're gonna, you're gonna figure out, you're gonna get where you need to get, even if maybe my life would look a little different if I hadn't taken some of those steps. Or maybe it would look exactly the same. Maybe I would have majored in supply chain and then I'm still doing, you know what I mean? Like it's like you don't know. Um so I wish that I'd I wish that a lot of those major milestone moments, I'd I'd worried less. And I'm sure if you ask me this again in 15 years, I'm gonna be like, God, I wish I'd listen to me then and stopped worrying for the next, you know, like but I think it I think life, I think life can can work out, and there's so many good choices, and so I don't know, you get where you need to be.

SPEAKER_00 36:49

Yeah, I agree. I I'm a worrier by nature too, very anxious, and it's all gonna work out the way it's gonna work out, whether you worry about it or not. So like worry is the stupidest emotion, but you can't control it either. But it's like I could be worried, like, yeah, like conferences in a couple weeks, it's gonna happen. All the good and the bad, it's gonna happen. It'll it'll be there. I remember I had my the first time I took my kid on an airplane when he was like nine months old. I asked my cousin who had just like flown with his child, they go, What's your advice? He goes, the flight's gonna take off and land, and whatever happens in between is gonna happen. It doesn't matter. I feel like and like I try to think about that all the time. Like you can plan as much as you want, but no matter once you get in the air with your baby, what's gonna happen is gonna happen. And then it's over. And I I really think about that often. Like, yeah, like at the most stressful moments of Elevate, when I'm getting my pedicure at the spa around the corner, or at there is a spa at Elevate this year at the Inverness, just saying. Um, and I typically do get a pedicure like in the day before Elevate to just have a moment to myself, but that's like when I'm sitting in that, like, yeah, good or bad, like it's gonna, you know, you've done everything you can. Um, and I try to I think about that often. Like, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 38:17

And I heard a podcast once, and it was a guy, and he was talking about like he was like, Okay, let's say you have something happening in three months that you're really worried about, so you spend that three months worrying, and then if it does happen, well, it was gonna happen anyway, whether you worried or not. Yeah, and but now you've wasted three months worrying about it, whereas like you could have had three months of chillness and then had this bad thing happening.

SPEAKER_00 38:38

Like it doesn't do anything, it doesn't, but my brain doesn't care, it's still gonna I know mine too. But I think it's great advice. If people can learn how to turn the worry off, you tell us, we would love to know.

SPEAKER_03 38:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 38:53

Well, thank you so much for all that you do for TMSA. So excited to see your session come June. Thank you for coming on the show today, and I will see you in a couple weeks in Denver.

SPEAKER_02 39:03

Thank you. Yes, thanks for having me. Good to see you.